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Larry Visoski 
October 15, 2009 
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A. 
Yes. 
Q. 
Okay. 
Tell me what some of those items are. 
A. 
I remember one specifically was a pool heater. 
Q. 
Excuse me? 
A. 
A pool heater. 
Q. 
When was that? 
A. 
1995-ish. 
Q. 
Okay. 
Why did you get that? 
A. 
I had built a pool and I didn't have a heater 
and he kind of laughed at me saying, "How can you have a 
pool without a heater?" So he says, "You ought to get a 
heater.• 
Q. 
Where were you when you had that conversation? 
A. 
In the airplane. 
O. 
How did he know that you had built a pool? 
A. 
Just in general conversation. 
Q. 
You were having a conversation with Jeffrey 
Epstein? 
A. 
Yes. 
Q. 
And this is something that was happening on 
the airplane, this conversation? 
A. 
During the flight. 
Yeah, it would have been 
like on cruise or something. 
Q. 
Okay. 
When you say •during the flight," does 
that --
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A. 
Again, you're going back a long ways. 
Q. 
I understand. 
We're talking about 1995 right 
now. 
A. 
Yes. 
Q. 
You're having a conversation with Jeffrey 
Epstein. 
Who is flying the airplane? 
A. 
The auto pilot and there's two crew. 
Q. 
Okay. So are you back in the back portion or 
is he up in the cockpit? 
A. 
Up in the cockpit. 
Q. 
Okay. 
Jeffrey Epstein sometimes comes up 
there? 
A. 
Just, yeah, in between the two pilot seats. 
Q. 
All right. 
Is that something that was 
typical, to have conversations like that? 
A. 
Mm-hmm. 
Q. 
Yes? 
A. 
Yes. 
No nodding. 
Q. 
And would those conversations be directed 
mainly with you or with the other pilots as well? 
A. 
Mainly with me. 
Q. 
I mean, you've kind of been described as the 
main guy or the main pilot. 
Wouldn't you consider that 
pretty much your role, right? 
A. 
Well, that's chief pilot. 
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Q. 
But more so than that, if there's going to be 
a casual conversation about a pool or a pool heater or 
whatever, it's going to be with you most likely if he's 
going to be talking to pilots, right? 
MR. CRITTON: Form. 
THE WITNESS: Right. 
BY MR. EDWARDS: 
Q. 
Okay. 
And you feel like over the years your 
relationship with Jeffrey Epstein has been pretty good? 
A. 
Yes. 
Q. 
And you have been closer to him over the years 
as you've grown to know him? 
MR. CRITTON: Form. 
THE WITNESS: 
The same throughout the same 
year. 
We never got any closer than 1991 than I am 
with him now. 
I'm very professional at what I do 
and know the line between being professional and 
thinking you're somebody's buddy. 
BY MR. EDWARDS: 
Q. 
Okay. So that's not something that you think 
you are? 
You don't think you're his buddy? 
A. 
No, sir. 
Q. 
Do you consider yourself his friend? 
A. 
I believe so. 
Q. 
Do you think he considers you his friend? 
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A. 
I think so. 
Q. 
All right. 
What makes you think that? 
MR. CRITTON: Speculation. 
THE WITNESS: 
He's always been kind and 
respectful. 
BY MR. EDWARDS: 
Q. 
Ever invited you to dinner? 
A. 
No, sir. 
Q. 
Have you ever associated or socialized with 
him during the day at any of his homes? 
A. 
Only during a business reason. 
Q. 
Okay. 
What are the other -- are the places 
that you believe that Mr. Epstein owns? 
I know we've 
talked about this Manhattan -- the Manhattan house. 
I've read the articles about it, the Palm Beach mansion. 
But what other places are you familiar with that 
Mr. Epstein owns? 
MR. CRITTON: Form; predicate, speculation. 
THE WITNESS: To answer it honestly, I don't 
know specifically that he owns any of the 
residences, to be honest. 
I would only assume that 
he owns. So if you want me to answer honestly, I 
don't know that he owns any of the other. 
BY MR. EDWARDS: 
Q. 
Okay. 
Well, what would be the basis for your 
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assumption that he owns the home in Palm Beach? 
A. 
He goes there, but I don't assume -- you don't 
have to own a house to go to it. 
Q. 
And not only does he go there, you're aware 
that he spends the night there; he resides there 
sometimes, correct? 
A. 
Yes. 
Q. 
When he's in Palm Beach, that's where he 
A. 
He sleeps. 
Q. 
-- sleeps? 
Right. 
When he's in New York, do 
you know where he sleeps? 
A. 
No. 
Q • 
But you've been to a particular house in New 
York that's a very large house that we've all read about 
that you picked up luggage at, right? 
A. 
Yes, sir. 
MR. CRITTON: 
Form. 
BY MR. EDWARDS: 
O. 
And that home, do you know that -- I know that 
you're saying that you haven't done a public record 
search to make sure that Jeffrey Epstein owns it. 
A. 
Yeah. 
Q. 
But you assume that he does? 
A. 
Assuming. 
Q. 
That's where he sleeps when he's in New York? 
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MR. CRITTON: Form. 
THE WITNESS: 
I assume. 
BY MR. EDWARDS: 
Q. 
That's where his luggage is when you pick it 
up? 
A. 
Doesn't mean he owns it. 
Q. 
Right. But that's where it is? 
A. 
Yes, sir. 
Q. 
Do you know of anybody else who owns that home 
in New York? 
A. 
No. 
Q. 
Okay. 
Have you been to his ranch in New 
Mexico? 
A. 
Yes. 
MR. CRITTON: Form. 
BY MR. EDWARDS: 
Q. 
How many times have you been to his ranch in 
New Mexico? 
MR. CRITTON: Form; predicate. 
THE WITNESS: 
A guesstimate, fifty times, only 
due to the fact that we would fly there. 
BY MR. EDWARDS: 
Q. 
And where would you land? 
A. 
Depending upon the aircraft, either 
Albuquerque or Santa Fe. 
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Q. 
Are those private airports? 
A. 
Public. 
Q. 
Public, okay. 
Are there any private landing 
places where you would land any airplanes in New Mexico? 
A. 
There are. 
Q. 
That you have landed --
A. 
That I have. 
Q. 
-- his airplane? 
A. 
Yes. 
Q. 
Where? 
A. 
We have a 4500-foot 
strip on the ranch. 
Q. 
When you say "we," yourself and somebody? 
A. 
The company. 
Q. 
What company? 
A. 
Well, I should say -- I see where you're going 
with that. 
The ranch owns -- whoever owns the ranch. 
The ranch has a runway on it. 
Q. 
Okay. 
And you've landed an airplane on that 
runway? 
A. 
That ranch, yes. 
Q. 
How many times do you think you've landed 
there? 
A. 
Ten. 
Q. 
All right. 
And have you been inside his 
ranch? 
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A. 
Yes. 
MR. CRITTON: Form to the last question. 
MR. REINHART: Can you clarify, the physical 
ranch or the residences or the structures on the 
ranch? 
MR. EDWARDS: 
I don't have a good visual 
appreciation for it. 
BY MR. EDWARDS: 
Q. 
Why don't you describe it in your words what 
this ranch that we are talking about looks like. 
And 
I've heard it referred to as the 2orro Ranch. 
Have you 
heard that? 
A. 
I've heard that. 
Q. 
That's the ranch we're all familiar with, 
we're talking about where the runway is and everything 
else? 
A. 
Yes. 
Q. 
Describe it in your own words, the landscaping 
of this ranch. 
What do we have on it? 
A. 
There is a house up on the hill, a large 
house. 
Q. 
How big? 
A. 
Big. I've read 40,000 square feet in the 
paper. 
Q. 
Have you been to it? 
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A. 
Yes. 
Q. 
Does that seem like it's feasible, 
approximately 40,000 --
A. 
I think so, yes. 
Q. 
What else do we have on it? 
A. 
There is a compound that has kind of motel 
room type -- they call it bunkhouse. 
Q. 
Where's the bunkhouse located? 
A. 
At the entrance to the ranch. 
Q. 
Okay. 
And what is that primarily used for? 
A. 
For the people that work on the ranch, they 
reside there. 
It's also a place where anybody that 
traveled on the airplane would stay. It's kind of like, 
you know, a hotel room. 
Q • 
And how far is that from the first house that 
you described, the 40,000 square foot house? 
A. 
It's probably 4 miles. 
Q. 
Okay. So the Zorro Ranch is a rather large 
area of property? 
A. 
Yes. 
Q. 
And how many times -- I know we just talked 
about how many times you've been in the house, but how 
many times have you been on that ranch in New Mexico, 
the Zorro Ranch? 
A. 
Thirty to fifty times over the years. That's 
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a guesstimate. 
Q. 
Is that over -- when was the first time that 
you went to that ranch? 
A. 
A guess, I don't know when it was, actually, 
our first trip, but 1995/'94. 
Q. 
Okay. 
And do you believe Jeffrey Epstein 
and/or a corporation owned or controlled by him to be 
the sole owner of that ranch? 
A. 
I don't know any of those details. 
Q. 
Have you ever talked to Jeffrey Epstein about 
who owns that ranch? 
A. 
No. 
Q. 
Do you know of anybody else who may own that 
ranch? 
A. 
Not to my knowledge. 
Q. 
Other than Jeffrey Epstein, do you know of 
anybody else who regularly stays there when they're in 
New Mexico? 
A. 
Not to my knowledge. 
Q. 
Does Jeffrey Epstein stay there when you're in 
New Mexico? 
A. 
He has. 
Q. 
And he has a key to the place? 
A. 
I don't know if there's a key. 
Q. 
One way or another, he gets in, right? 
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A. 
Yes, sir. 
Q. 
And he sleeps there? 
A. 
Yes. 
Q. 
Okay. 
A. 
I assume he does. 
Q. 
You assume he sleeps? 
A. 
I do. 
I think. 
Q. 
Okay. 
MR. CRITTON: This is really --
BY MR. EDWARDS: 
Q. 
Other than the pool heater in 1995, have you 
ever received any other gifts on top of the compensation 
from Mr. Epstein? 
A. 
I did get land on the ranch to build a house. 
0. 
What do you mean you got land on the ranch? 
A. 
He deeded me land to build a home. 
Q. 
When was that? 
A. 
Ten years ago at least. 
Q. 
Do you know if he's ever deeded anyone else in 
this world land on the ranch to build a home? 
A. 
Not to my knowledge. 
Q. 
Why did he do that? 
A. 
We would vacation out there and my wife fell 
in love with New Mexico and we were looking for 
property. 
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Q • 
And did you talk to him about that? 
A. 
Yes. 
He knew I -- he was aware I was looking 
for a home and he says, "Well, I have so much land, I 
could give you a spot to build a home on.' So I built a 
house. 
Q. 
So how long has a home actually been on that 
property? 
A. 
Nine years. 
Q. 
And that's a home that you own? 
A. 
Yes, sir. 
Q. 
And that's a home that was -- when I say "you 
own it,' is there a mortgage on it or did he give it to 
you free and clear? 
A. 
No, no, I paid for the house. 
I made payments 
on it. 
Q. 
All right. So what did he actually give you? 
A. 
40-acres of land. 
Q. 
That you did not have to pay for? 
A. 
You know, I'd have to go back and look. 
I 
think it was -- I had to pay something for it. 
I don't 
remember. 
Q. 
How often have you visited that piece -- that 
home that you own? 
A. 
My wife would spend summers out there with the 
kids. 
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Q. 
Okay. 
But that's on the Zorro Ranch? 
A. 
Yes. 
Q. 
So in addition to the 50 or so times you've 
been to the Zorro Ranch, you've been to your property 
that's on the Zorro Ranch? 
A. 
Yes, which over the years, it's once-a-year 
visits. So I mean, it is included in the 50 times that 
I've been there. 
Q. 
Okay. 
And did you have a conversation with 
him that led to him giving you or gifting you 40-acres 
of land? 
A. 
We talked about it because he knew I was 
looking for a home out there. 
Q. 
Okay. 
In gifting you that land, did you 
consider yourself at that point in time to be more than 
just his pilot, as more of a friend? 
A. 
No. 
You're using the word "gifting." 
I paid 
for the land. 
I don't recall what it was. 
But you use 
the word "friend." I don't know that a -- sure, he was 
a friend. 
I mean.. . 
Q. 
Well, did he give Dave Rogers any land out on 
the New Mexico ranch? 
A. 
No. 
Q. 
Okay. 
When you say you paid for it, I thought 
that I asked that question, "Did you pay for the 
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40-acres?" 
I thought your answer was, "I don't know, 
I'd have to go back and look." 
Are you saying now that you did pay for that 
land? 
A. 
I don't remember. 
If there was a sum of 
money, it was just for, you know, the legal purpose of a 
transfer of ownership of the land. 
Q. 
Okay. 
If it was a substantial amount of 
money, that's something that you would have remembered? 
A. 
Oh, exactly. No, it was not a substantial 
amount. 
Q. 
Okay. Do you remember approximately how much 
money you had to give Jeffrey Epstein for that land? 
A. 
I would only be guessing. 
It might have been 
five dollars. To my knowledge, I don't remember. 
Q. 
Okay. So when I'm saying he gave you the 
land, he may have actually given you the land? 
A. 
Sure. 
Q. 
Okay. 
And to the best of your knowledge, he's 
never given anyone else land out there? 
A. 
Not to my knowledge. 
MR. CRITTON: Form. 
BY MR. EDWARDS: 
Q. 
All right. 
How big is this house that you 
built on the ranch? 
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A. 
1800 square feet. 
Q. 
Were you ever at that house at the same time 
when he's at his house that's on that Zorro Ranch? 
A. 
Yes. 
Q. 
All right. 
We started back in 1991 with you 
making around $55,000 a year and that has progressed 
over time to a point where in 2007 you were making 
$200,000 a year. 
I don't want to go through every 
single year; that would take a really long time. But 
the progression, was that on a yearly basis normally or 
after two years or three years? 
A. 
Yearly basis. 
Q. 
Okay. 
And would that normally be in 
increments of? 
A. 
$5,000. 
Q. 
Okay. 
You've talked about a couple other 
gifts that have been given to you from Jeffrey Epstein 
over the years; one is a pool heater in 1995 and now 
some 40 acres of land on his New Mexico ranch. 
Any 
other gifts you can think about? 
A. 
No other gifts. 
Q. 
Okay. 
I don't want to split hairs with you. 
You obviously thought about that answer before giving 
it. 
What other items are you thinking about that he's 
given to you or cut you a discount on or otherwise that 
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you feel was compensation for you working for him? 
A. 
I drive a company car. 
I mean.. . 
Q. 
Okay. 
What kind of car? 
A. 
A Hummer. 
L LC? 
36 
Q. 
You say 'a company car." 
That's owned by NES, 
A. 
No, I think the registration has Zorro 
Development on it. 
Q. 
What is Zorro Development? 
A. 
I believe that's the ranch, or at least it has 
the name of the ranch. 
I don't know what the entity is. 
Q. 
And it's your understanding that that's a 
company vehicle? 
A. 
Yes. 
Q. 
And where is that vehicle primarily garaged? 
A. 
At my home. 
Q. 
In 
or in the Zorro Ranch? 
A. 
No, here in 
Q. 
All right. 
And is there only one company 
vehicle that you're issued? 
A. 
Yes, sir. 
Q. 
And is that something that was -- that you did 
not have to pay for? 
A. 
No, it's just something I drive. 
I mean, it's 
not titled to me or anything like that. 
It's just a car 
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that I drive. 
Q. 
All right. 
You've worked for him for 18 
37 
years. 
I don't even know how long the Hummer would 
last, but presumably, that's not the car you've had over 
the entire 18 years. 
Have you always had a company car? 
A. 
No, I haven't, no. 
Q. 
When did you get the Hummer? 
A. 
Probably three years ago. 
Q. 
Do any other members of Mr. Epstein's piloting 
team have company cars? 
A. 
No. 
Q. 
Only you? 
A. 
Yes. 
Q. 
And do you know how that decision was made to 
get you a company vehicle? 
A. 
No. 
Q. 
What do you use that vehicle for? 
A. 
To and from the airport. 
also? 
Q. 
All right. 
Do you use it for personal reasons 
A. 
I guess, yes. 
Q. 
I mean, that's your primary vehicle? 
A. 
Yes, or I drive my wife's car. 
Q. 
Which is? 
A. 
Type of car? 
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Q. 
Yes. 
A. 
A Mercedes. 
Q. 
And is that something that was also a gift 
from Mr. Epstein? 
A. 
No, sir. 
Q. 
What type of Mercedes is that? 
A. 
A ML 430, ten years old. 
Q. 
All right. 
Are there any other items 
company car, the land in New Mexico, the pool heater 
any other items that Mr. Epstein has given you over time 
as compensation or reward or anything else? 
A. 
No, sir. 
Q. 
And your only income is from Mr. Epstein or 
his companies? 
A. 
Correct. 
Q. 
Okay. 
And it's been that way since 1991? 
A. 
Yes. 
Q. 
How did you meet Mr. Epstein or become 
involved with him in 1991? 
A. 
We heard at the airport that Mr. Epstein was 
purchasing an airplane when Dave Rogers and myself were 
living in Columbus, and we had the opportunity to 
interview with him, and we did and got the job. 
Q. 
And this is before he owned the airplane? 
A. 
Yes. 
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Q. 
And which airplane was that? 
A. 
The Hawker. 
Q. 
Does he still have the Hawker? 
A. 
No. 
Q • 
How long did he have that plane? 
39 
A. 
Five years, guesstimate; four or five years. 
Q. 
So sometime in the mid '90s? 
A. 
Yes. 
Q. 
Did you keep any type of logs or documentation 
as to who would have been flying on that airplane if you 
transported any individuals? 
A. 
The same logs as you possess now are the 
flight logs. 
Q. 
Okay. 
A. 
That's the standard for the industry. 
Q. 
So that's something that you kept, or that 
Dave Rogers kept? 
A. 
Dave Rogers. 
Q. 
Okay. 
If there are any documents out there 
with names of passengers on any of the flights involving 
planes owned or controlled by Jeffrey Epstein and/or his 
companies, those would be documents in the possession of 
Dave Rogers and not yourself? 
A. 
Oh, the corporation actually, they belong to. 
Q. 
Okay. 
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MR. REINHART: 
That was a compound question. 
You might want to split it in half. 
MR. EDWARDS: 
Okay. 
BY MR. EDWARDS: 
Q. 
What documents do you believe exist that 
indicate names of individuals that have been passengers 
on Mr. Epstein's airplanes? 
MR. REINHART: 
Are we going back all the way 
from '91 to the present? 
MR. EDWARDS: 
Sure. 
THE WITNESS: 
You're talking about the Hawker? 
BY MR. EDWARDS: 
Q. 
Any airplanes. 
What documents would there be? 
A. 
There would be the same: 
Flight logs and 
passenger manifests would exist. 
Q. 
And are either of those required? 
A. 
The flight log is required for the aircraft to 
- rack times and landings. 
Q. 
And in the flight log, is it required that you 
designate the names of the passengers? 
A. 
No. 
Q. 
That's just something that Dave Rogers did on 
his own? 
A. 
Everybody does that. 
It's more for Internal 
Revenue. 
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